Tuesday, May 6, 2014

Kronos Stream Log - May 5th

For those who were not able to tune in, and don't really want to watch a ~2hr raw recap, I'm publishing stream minutes here as a TL;DR service.  The header will be sources of information (devblogs, eve-o forum, tweets, etc), the body will include minutes covered, and the post will conclude with opinions and a link to the raw stream.

Dev Blogs

Dev Posts

Stream Minutes

Kronos build was not released to Singularity yet.  Instead, I walked through each of the devblogs and my personal reactions.  Below are some boiled down explanations.  I tried to keep each section to 10mins.

Reprocess All The Things

This blog sets the tone for all the changes:
  1. There will no longer be such a thing as "perfect" in any segment of industry
  2. Every method/trick of industry will need to be reevaluated
  3. Not every activity should be sustainable in every type of space - Grayscale
These are the points you should keep in mind when evaluating the industry changes as a whole.  Reprocessing stands to break "solo capital" building and much of solo mission running.  It also stands to boost most of traditional mining.  The new compression mechanics are the most interesting part; these will lead to a compressed ore market that functions only loosely based on the raw mineral market.

Building Better Worlds

The manufacturing changes are, again, a place that turns the entire industry paradigm on its head.  With the end to slots, factory needs become much flatter.  NPC space vs POS space will become a much more transparent choice, rather than a "if you want to do X, you MUST use a POS".  For more of my direct feelings see my post on the matter.

Industry UI

Honestly, I glossed over this devblog.  I have no business designing or talking about designing UIs, so I feel completely inadequate reviewing them without putting my hands on the process.  The interesting thing to note is any job installed can be reinstalled with one click.  Said another way, invention becomes much less of a click fest.

Though, I'd like to raise some argument against CCP's evaluation that traditional Science & Industry ("Building Things") is a purely solo activity.  I strongly believe that T2 manufacturing benefits from cooperative gameplay.  I am biased, having run two cooperative T2 corps in my tenure, but it's laughably inaccurate to not include at least a half-circle for T2 industry.

Researching the Future

If I may gush for a second, I REALLY like these changes.  Much like when Learning skills were removed from the game, I was hesitant at first, but I have really come around to the changes.  The mechanic fits better into the world, the math is far more transparent, and the quality of a BPO is now completely obvious.

It was pointed out in the chat room that a research/build/research cycle methodology is going away.  With exponential time per level, it will be a lot less prudent to research this way.  Also, with the levels getting longer, it presents a larger POS risk, since that +1 might cost 30 days, and it will be painful to cancel that kind of job.  On the other hand, NPC research is going to actually become a thing, so high-value research might return to NPC space, at a premium cost.

The Price of Change

This one is a doozy, and I'm going to need to fiddle with it live to completely solidify my ideas about it.  Simply put, EVERY job will cost something to install, and that cost will be related to the raw-material cost of that product.  It will behoove builders to spread wide away from hubs to save money on install costs.

The install equation should make lowsec capital producers cheer though.  With the "activity multiplier" being balanced against "system build resources", lowsec stands to have some wins in this equation over nullsec.  

Also, it was pointed out that this is a significant ISK sink.  I am no traditional economist, but this makes me worry slightly.  My calculations point to this being bigger than all the other sinks combined.  I agree that CCP needs more levers to destroy ISK from the game, but this stands to be a bludgeon, not a scalpel.  

Industry Teams

I know that a lot of the community was eagerly anticipating this to be a cooperative mechanic.  Instead, CCP delivered a rather weird modifier mechanic.  Again, since this is such a weird mechanic, I have to hold off full reactions until I get my hands on them.  I can sum up my reaction as: "I like them... but".

As they are proposed today, Teams stand to be weirdly leveraged at release.  Highsec people might have the largest bidding power, but nullsec will have the greatest utilization potential.  Through organization, the best teams will most likely be shipped out to nullsec, with middle/low teams being slurped up by really ambitious industrialists.

The iteration targets have me filled with hope, but the release as-is is a little lacking.  Without a means to have exclusive control, or to groom teams for my actual needs, these are going to be a weird mechanic to leverage in the short term.

Stream Notes

The theme I'll be beating into the ground on these streams is "Everything you knew is wrong."  The changes are so sweeping and broad, it's easiest to consider industry independently in Pre-Kronos vs Post-Kronos terms.  Trying to talk about these changes as "just tweak X and continue as normal" is not going to fly.  If you want to prosper going forward, you will need to redesign your industrial operation from the ground up.

This episode is just meant to be a top-level view of the changes.  Since we're treating the changes as a completely new process to industry, you can't optimize what you don't understand.  In the following episodes, we will dig down into specifics as they become available.  In my own notes, I am writing more specific schedules and priorities for the future streams up to release.

Where to Watch


Subscribe to EVE-Prosper on Youtube (not uploaded here yet... need to fix Twitch)

7 comments:

Dinsdale Pirannha said...

Did you want help setting stuff up on Sisi, if and when the 1st build shows up?

John Purcell said...

I will still need help, but it will be reliant on when the mirror is released. I'll push more info once the Kronos candidate is on the test server.

Dinsdale Pirannha said...

Your You Tube vid stopped at 31:50, mid-sentence.
One thing, right near the very end of your presentation. You said that you hope that manufacturing costs were based on the input costs. All that I have read indicates it is the output costs.

Building a faction module coming from an LP BPC just went from 1200 ISK for a 40 minute job to anywhere from 25 -100 million.

John Purcell said...

THAT is worrying. I will add that to my list of things to investigate/break/post about.

Lofty Lazerus said...

I love it.... "Stupid filter" ,,, me to and lmao
should I construct my T2 bpc I have laying around now? Extra gets 'moved' to regular and then affected by -4/-3
also is there any word on when the build will drop to sisi, of immediate concern to me is the req/mats for T2 Venture. Buy the materials early, save money and be ready to ship on release day :)

Quixilva said...

The proposed ME level conversions also excessively penalise invented blueprints. While at present a ME-4 BPC requires 136.4% of the materials of a ME0 PBC, after the expansion it will require 140%. Additionally the change from using the perfect baseline to using the ME0 baseline will actually increase all material requirements by 1.1% before rounding.

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